A seemingly well regarded doctor from the U.S. condemns smart meters like those Hydro-Quebec is installing as bad for the health. He says the counterclaims that they’re harmless are based on the premise that the emissions are not strong enough to heat up the human body but that damage can be done below that level. Le Devoir even has the PDF version of his submission (which is in English).
Updates from May, 2012 Toggle Comment Threads | Keyboard Shortcuts
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The tentative deal reached on the weekend between the government and the heads of the main student groups is falling down as it fails to receive the approval of many student groups. The FEUQ is now asking for changes and clarifications in the document.
There’s been some outcry at the force and methods used by police against students at some demonstrations and some doubt cast on how things went toward the end of the negotiations.
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Kevin
Lots of good articles in La Presse this morning; it almost looks like a special section on all aspects of education.
Interesting article on page A8 showing that Quebec has always had less participation than Ontario. But that in the 90s, as Quebec had a tuition freeze and Mike Harris hiked rates, the number of Quebecers getting degrees dropped.Rate of attendance for francophones is still 6% lower than for Anglos and allos
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Kate
You say that like you expect it to be challenged. I’m not surprised it’s true, it’s probably ascribable to the lingering effects of the Catholic church on the Quebec psyche, but that’s not something we’re going to get any objective studies on.
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C_Erb
A lot of it has to do with the fact that many students can go to CEGEP for free and get by quite easily with that degree. Outside of Quebec, many of those students opt for university instead of college.
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Kevin
@Kate,
Naw, I just like repeatedly pointing out that the cost of education has nothing to do with how many people decide to get an education, since thousands of protesters are convinced of the opposite. -
Kate
Kevin, surely education could be priced out of the reach of a lot of people, so I think it’s a misstatement to say the cost of education has “nothing to do” with how many people choose to pursue it.
I was struck today by this Globe & Mail piece about how young adults do have higher expenses than the boomer kids did.
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Kevin
@Kate,
Oh sure, make it $40,000 and only the super-rich or those truly dedicated will go.
But that’s not what’s going on here. We’re talking about raising tuition to slightly less than the Canadian average.Or at least we were. Now it seems to have become a political streetfight on the role of education in society.
As for Rob Carrick, he ignores people who had to pay down debt with 18% interest rates :/ And people who graduated in the 90s to an economy in the toilet.
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Mayor Tremblay, who has floated this notion before, is talking again about a ban on facial coverings by demonstrators.
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steph
I doubt the Victoriaville SQ had as much practice as the SPVM when dealing with protesters.
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steph
^^ replied to wrong post. As for Tremblay, I wonder if it’ll also apply to the riot cops that don’t show badge numbers.
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Ian
Do extensive beards count? If you back-combed they’d be pretty much the same as wearing a bandana, and much more stylish. Plus I hear the chicks dig it. If this law passes, I lay 2 to 1 odds that in the first week someone gets busted just for wearing a scarf around their neck. That’s pretty much half of Montreal right there.
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Bert
Does that include things like the person wearing in the photo on this CTV page? http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/Canada/20110316/montreal-anti-police-protest-110316/ or this one http://www.demotix.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/large_610x456_scaled/photos/rally-against-police-brutality-montreal_625592.jpg ?
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OpenFile’s got quite the immersive multimedia feature on the people losing their homes at 780 Saint-Rémi.
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Raoul
arent those the same loft units the city was threatening to close down? maybe i have the wrong end of town
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Kate
The same landlord has buildings in Saint-Henri and in Rosemont that are not zoned residential but where people have been living for many years. Some details.
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Antonio
Rue d’Iberville is still La-Petite-Patrie, not quite Rosemont.
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Kate
Where is the boundary, then? You can’t tell from the official borough maps, which don’t even show a defined area called La-Petite-Patrie. The subsections of that borough are called Marie-Victorin, Saint-Édouard, Vieux-Rosemont and Étienne-Desmarteau. D’Iberville cuts right through the middle of Étienne-Desmarteau. I am confused.
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Postmedia, owner of the Gazette among others, today dropped its own wire service that it had created in 2007 and has gone back to using CP wire. This means 25 journalistic layoffs across Canada. Postmedia note to staff.
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Both police and protesters are known to acquire equipment at army surplus stores although the shopkeepers deny any huge run on their stock.
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A rooming house fire killed two people in the Point Sunday night. Firefighters noted a lack of smoke alarms in the building.
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A smaller but determined group of students marched Sunday night against tuition hikes. There were only two arrests.
Meantime, CLASSE claims that there was dirty work at the crossroads at the negotiating table and three clauses were omitted from the final document. There’s a pretty strange story about the government choosing and isolating one student negotiator and putting the full signing responsibility on his shoulders.
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mdblog
Good. I hope that the deal doesn’t go through. After taking a closer look, this is merely a band-aid solution that will inevitably lead to the same confrontations in the future. The only difference will be that Gabriel Nadeau-Dubois will be on the government side of the negotiating table when it does! Oh how sweet and ironic life can be! :)
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paul
I’m sure GND has a bright career ahead of him, and there is no denying his popularity amongst certain demographics – but if we’re playing hypotheticals he would be much better suited as a union leader.
Politicians aren’t very successful if they encourage radicalism, civil disobedience and lack the ability to compromise. A successful politician doesn’t draw their line in the sand and defend it by all means; they set an objective, move pragmatically towards it and have to be flexible with the final results (and their values).I agree though – How ironic it would be if he had to manage the diverse needs of a society rather than a distinct subsect
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Jack
Yves Boisvert had an interesting take on power dynamics in Quebec politics, one that is not operational anywhere else in North America.
.http://www.lapresse.ca/debats/chroniques/yves-boisvert/201205/06/01-4522604-la-contribution-syndicale.php -
ant6n
This deal seems all win for the government. They don’t have to budge at all, never having to rethink their choice to reduce gov’t contribution to education. And students are ‘given’ the chance to try to save money in the university system, something that the government should do. This will just shift the conflict from students vs government to students vs universities/profs/employees.
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Jack
“Si le comité affirme que Philippe Lapointe( CLASSE) prend l’entière responsabilité de la signature sans vérification du document” Dude, before you sign read the document.
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Kate
After being kept awake for 22 hours and isolated from the other reps?
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Raoul
I agree. This deal is only putting off the problem until after the election.
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Kevin
Maybe I’m missing something, but students don’t really hold any cards here.
The government has offered a whole bunch of stuff: free school for the poor and middle class, a seat( well, 4 out of 19 seats) on a board to look at university management, and the promise of reducing some fees if savings can be found.Students are not going to get free tuition, ever, unless they stage a coup. And that would last all of five minutes :/
If there is something else Charest can offer, or ever will offer, I’m not seeing it
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Kate
Vincent Marissal has a good piece today on why seeing the negotiations in terms of “holding cards” – i.e. in game-playing terms – is not helping.
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Adam Hooper 01:02 on 2012/05/08 Permalink
The papers he cites (which he and some colleagues wrote) are not peer-reviewed. That means they are not published in a scientific journal. Three likely reasons: either he never applied, journal editors rejected his papers (conspiracy-theory), or independent scientists do not agree that he is unbiased.
In fact, independent reviewers have said quite the opposite: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bioinitiative_Report#cite_note-PathoMBlank-1
This Devoir article presents nothing new at all–it’s just quoting one of the few scientists who was at the root of all the fearmongering in the first place. Plus, it doesn’t look to independently validate the scientist’s assertions. As several comments correctly state, it’s bad journalism.
Maybe science is wrong about these hydro gizmos. The global scientific community does get some things wrong–sometimes using valid science. But why should we base our distress on *invalid* science?
Faiz Imam 01:30 on 2012/05/08 Permalink
For reference, here is the key point Dr Carpenter is quoted on in all the stories:
“while no one has actually done human health studies in relation to people living in homes with smart meters, we have evidence from a whole variety of other sources of radiofrequency exposure that demonstrates convincingly and consistently that exposure to radiofrequency radiation at elevated levels for long periods of time increases the risk of cancer, increases the damage to the nervous system, causes electrosensitivity, has adverse reproductive effects, and a variety of other effects on different organ systems.”
This whole discussion boils down to “elevated levels for long periods of time” According to the vast majority of experts, such levels are much higher than actually occur with smart meters, routers, microwaves, etc. Even cell phones, which are nukes in comparison with the other items, are generally considered safe (though there is some legitimate debate still)
MB 03:09 on 2012/05/08 Permalink
Le Devoir should be ashamed of publishing pseudo-science…but then again, bidness is bidness, isn’t it? (Hullo global warming “debate.”)
Marc 05:38 on 2012/05/08 Permalink
Just because something is in Le Devoir doesn’t mean it’s true. Dr. David Carpenter drank the KoolAid, it seems. The smart meters operate at 900 MHz and the amount of power that can be emitted at that frequency doesn’t have anywhere near enough energy to damage chemical bonds. 900 MHz is what cordless phones operated on for many years.
Kevin 05:44 on 2012/05/08 Permalink
When will know-nothings start doing research instead of going: that newfangled stuff MUST be dangerous!
Chris 07:47 on 2012/05/08 Permalink
Society bends over backwards to accommodate the biggest non-science ever: God & religion. Given that, I don’t see why these meters can’t be optional.
Kevin 07:50 on 2012/05/08 Permalink
@Chris They are optional — but you have to pay $17 a month (or something like that) for the privilege of remaining ignorant.
Chris 08:03 on 2012/05/08 Permalink
There are other reasons to not want these meters:
A) Wireless devices are easy to hack, and criminals have started:
http://krebsonsecurity.com/2012/04/fbi-smart-meter-hacks-likely-to-spread/
B) Wireless devices can interfere with other wireless devices:
http://www.securityweek.com/smart-meters-interfering-home-electronics
C) Smart meters can weaken your privacy:
http://www.h-online.com/security/news/item/Smart-meters-reveal-TV-viewing-habits-1346385.html
These criticisms are decidedly hi-tech and easily testable hypotheses. If you ask me, you have to pay $17 as a penalty for not being ignorant.
Anto 08:15 on 2012/05/08 Permalink
@Chris: The new meters will allow Hydro Québec to charge more for electricity used during rush hours.
Jack 08:17 on 2012/05/08 Permalink
Right on Chris, the Smart meters are more about who is complaining.@Anto we should pay more for Hydro, that is the only way will constrain our consumption and leave the First Nations rivers alone.
Anto 08:21 on 2012/05/08 Permalink
@Jack: I was not complaining, just explaining why the meters can’t be optional.
Chris 08:30 on 2012/05/08 Permalink
It is possible to hold conflicting views. :) For example, I agree electricity should cost more during peak hours. (In fact, I think electricity should be much more expensive than it is now, at all times.) At the same time I dislike smart meters, for the reasons above. I want to have my cake and eat it too. :)
Kate 08:43 on 2012/05/08 Permalink
Maybe I should assure you guys that I didn’t post that link because I buy the doctor’s theory, but because it’s an issue that’s not going away here and we’ll be hearing more about it.
qatzelok 09:20 on 2012/05/08 Permalink
What could possibly be wrong with introducing new chemicals, radio waves, or other unnatural things into our environment? New technologies are miracles. Can’t wait for my flying saucer to be ready – as long as it’s a hybrid.
/Faith in gadgets
Kate 09:43 on 2012/05/08 Permalink
Well, it goes both ways. People are always suspicious of new technology. But new technology has quite often turned out to be bad for us. The only thing to hang onto here is science. I’m willing to bet there’s an 95% chance the RF from those meters is harmless (maybe unless you sleep cuddled up against one) but if legitimate studies begin to show they have statistical risks then we would be the stupid ones to go on maintaining they must be safe.
(I’m also aware of the difficulty of getting truly unbiased studies on stuff like this, a further complication.)
Faiz Imam 13:21 on 2012/05/08 Permalink
In contrast to the safety concerns, The security ones are very much valid. Consider the new high tech RFID driver licences and passports we have, anyone can get a professional scanner off ebay, and relatively low level clearance in needed into customs canada databases to connect it to all our info.
In the case of smart meters it is a 100% software issue. The reality is that all new software has bugs in it, and as soon as there is a reason to do so, you can be sure these meters will become as vulnerable as Windows XP.
Kate 16:51 on 2012/05/08 Permalink
Faiz Imam, maybe I’m lacking in evil imagination, but what can a random hacker do with information about how many kilowatts I’m using and when?
Chris 20:59 on 2012/05/08 Permalink
For one, he could deduce if you are home, and therefore know when a good time to rob you is.
Kate 21:59 on 2012/05/08 Permalink
If he’s a good hacker he already has better hardware than I’ve got.
But I take your point.
Faiz Imam 00:17 on 2012/05/09 Permalink
Kate you do have a point, currently the risks are quite minute.
But remember that the “smart home” is gonna get pretty damn smart.
Soon large appliances like dryers and dishwashers and electric cars will connect and communicate directly with the smart meter so that they can work at off peak hours.
And its quite conceivable that all manner of smaller(smarter) devices will also communicate this way. And inevitably, the fact is all methods of communication can be co-opted.
Thus a full inventory of the tech in your home, plus access to your local computer network is not inconceivable. And who knows? at some point I could imagine a plug-in hybrid being unlocked and stolen via a security hole of this kind.
My overall point is, once everything is connected, every vulnerability becomes exponentially more valuable.
I know for a fact that a luxury car of some kind had its security compromised by wiring a computer into a unremarkable sensor(maybe a brake wear sensor?) because auto engineers are simply not trained to think of security. The problem is neither are hydro workers…